Episode 011 - Guest Interview: Chi-Chi Ari
Our guest today is Chi-Chi Ari, an award-winning wedding and lifestyle photographer. Chi-Chi talks about the decision to move from pre-med to fashion design to photography, the evolution of her pricing strategy, and shooting George Clooney.
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Show Notes
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Guest: Chi-Chi Ari
Chi-Chi’s website
Chi-Chi’s Instagram
Daily Ritual: Women at Work book
The walking/ mind-clearing philosophy is called Passive Perception
The Paris Apartment book
Homework:
Notice the art in the things you wouldn’t otherwise think about as art (esp film).
Example films: Queen and Slim and The Lobster.
We would love to hear from you! Email us your questions and ideas at podcast at artbymegan dot com
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Friend:
Welcome to The Arts, a brand new podcast about art and money. I've spent my career managing at some of the world's largest financial institutions. So I can't tell you my name, but trust me, talking about money is my jam.
Megan: And I'm Megan, I'm an artist and a teacher. And now co-host of this amazing podcast. We're having this conversation because we came to a realization. We have no idea how the other person spends her workday.
Friend: Or her money. So let's chat about it.
Megan: On today's show, we are talking with one of the most talented photographers that we have both had the pleasure of working with.
Friend: Agreed. And honestly, also one of the most kind humans there is, we're so excited to talk with our friend Chi-Chi.
Megan: Oh, my gosh. I love her. She has such a beautiful eye for photography that honestly, I haven't encountered much. She's so talented.
Friend: Yeah.
I'm hoping that we'll get to understand a little bit, Like what is her magic fairy dust formula. She's also stunning and I've talked to her about this. I've tried to persuade her to be a model and she has no interest in it. she could easily be subject.
Yeah.
Megan: She's one of those people you like walk into a coffee shop and you're like, whoa,
Friend: Whoa. Is someone famous here? Where's her entourage.
Megan: She also has like, not to be a nut job, but she has like an aura. Okay. Enough of us.
Sorry, Chi-Chi. We love you. And we're normal people. One little disclaimer, we are, a podcast that interviews, mostly women and women are also working moms. Many of our guests are moms with new little babies at home working during what we like to still call the pandemic. I mean, whatever is happening.
Friend: Which makes them very impressive.
Megan: I mean, true heroes is what's happening here
on this podcast,
but, we have our guests Chi-Chi today and her guest podcast.
Friend: Yeah, very sweet. A very sweet little extra guest.
Megan: So if you hear little peeps in the background, that's why.
Friend: And, if you want to know the cuteness behind the
noise, you can definitely find it on Chi-Chi's Instagram.
Megan: I'm like squealing.
Friend: Yeah. Cool. So that's, you know, hopefully it's not too distracting. We won't apologize for it because we think what Chi-Chi has to say is pure gold And it's worth a little bit of background noise to get her to speak to us.
Megan: And if you're a guy and you don't like it, then just turn off the podcast.
Friend: Listen to the next episode. That's fine.
Megan: Or just find one for men.
Friend: Or just go and thank your partner for being amazing.
Megan: Anyway, sorry about all the shots fired, but
Friend: yeah. I mean, there's nothing, this is why I want to just like say it because it's not, we are not perfect. We're never going to be perfect. And we
Megan: No.
Friend: be, want real women telling us about their real lives.
Megan: But first, The Scene.
Friend: The Scene. All right. So, um, what's trending in the arts slash finance world this week?
All right. I've got a book for you. I'm so excited. I've been waiting all week until this recording session. Right now. I have a book that was written just for you, Megan. It is called daily rituals, women at work.
Megan: It's like the podcast.
Friend: You, know, it.
Megan: I know it, but I love it and I want to go reread it. So don't, don't worry.
Friend: Okay. So it is like the podcast. the book is called Daily Rituals, Women at Work by Mason Curry. this was in my library, a yard sale, or I just grabbed everything that said art.
it is, like the podcast. It's an easy read, quick little snippets and stories. It's all about how these artists get their work done. What are their patterns? What are their habits? When are they on? When are they off? What did the people around them observe? I thought you would love it if you've already read it fine.
But for those who are enjoying this podcast, which we hope is everyone, I would recommend it. It's a, It's a great read. I think it would actually be a nice coffee table book.
Megan: Totally. It's a good conversation topic also, did you find a common thread a little bit?
Friend: I haven't quite finished it yet, but I'm so far surprised at how many of these women are no longer living and found that in their latest years they had This need to produce. It was like, as we get older, we realize that time is limited. And so we become more prolific. And that so far has been my, my real takeaway is like, don't waste time when you're young, because when you're old, you're going to wish you had been working harder.
Megan: Yes.
Friend: What was your, what were you getting at?
Megan: Mine is not as exciting or inspirational. just noticed that they all take walks a lot. Like everyone's walking, walking, constant walking like everyone's ritual is to go from.
Friend: Well, it's mind resetting.
Megan: Yes. There's a, there's a term for this where you're not looking for information, but passively absorbing, maybe it's a Julia Cameron thing from The Artist's Way, but there's a, philosophy on this where you must passively absorb things in order to be creative. I'll work on that for you.
Friend: We should have a look at that. But I definitely do this in my own work. And sometimes I feel bad because we're definitely a culture of Like bums in seats. The only way we know you're working is if you're sitting in front of your computer, but most of the problems that I solve at work are solved while I'm running, playing tennis, riding my bike, walking, sleeping.
Do you know what I mean?
Megan: Yeah. Like it's like your brain has to be in motion sometimes, you know?
Friend: I give myself permission to, to not be seen sitting at my desk. I don't care if someone comes by and they're like, where were you I'm like, ah, I was solving your problem while I was sipping tea.
Megan: In motion.
Friend: You're welcome.
Megan: I was in motion. Thanks Steve.
Friend: Is that your character?
Megan: Well, you, a guy at work that wears a polar fleece vest is named Steve or like Rick. I was in motion, Rick. Thanks. Just answer them that and don't follow up and be like, we're done here.
Friend: All right, what's happening? in your part of the world.
Megan: I'm sorry to report, but I'm reading a murder mystery.
I don't ever read novels like this. It has nothing to do with this podcast, but I'm telling you all. You're welcome. Have you read Lucy Foley's books?
Friend: No, I do not read anything mysterious or suspenseful because then I can't sleep.
Megan: No, no, this isn't like that.
Friend: That's how my brain reacts to suspense is to not sleep.
So no, tell me about it.
Megan: For some reason it's not gory. There's no mention of anything disgusting, which I think is a trigger for me. This is just an intellectual mystery. So I'm currently reading The Paris Apartment. It's like this, who done it?
Thing? can't say anything or I'll ruin the whole story.
Friend: That's it. That's all you get. I think that's enough. A Paris apartment.
Megan: Read
Friend: Do you find when you're reading these types of books, that you don't get anything else done because it's such a page turner. You have to get it done. You have to finish it?
Megan: I literally ignored my children last night. I was like, you're on your own. I got to get to the bottom of this mystery. They were like, mom dinner. I was like, hold on.
Friend: Just order it. Just be like here's Uber eats.
Megan: You'll be fine. Just go to the fridge.
Yeah. So that's that?
Friend: Okay. Let's do this thing.
The Main Exhibit.
Megan: are super excited today to be joined by a good friend of ours, Chi-Chi, a super talented lifestyle and wedding photographer. That we both love. Chi-Chi has been featured in Harper's Bazaar. Yes. You heard that correctly and Bride's Magazine and is extremely talented and well loved.
Thank you for joining.
Chi-Chi: Thank you. It's so exciting to be here.
Friend: Welcome Chi-Chi. We're glad that We were able to snag you for, for a few minutes. We know you're so busy, with all of your life and business, whirlwind of events. thank you for finding time for us. We're excited to interview you. I would also just like to say that you have somehow managed to capture both of us in our awkwardness separately with our families in our awkwardness and make us look stunning.
Megan: Truly, it's a, gift.
Friend: That's a magic gift.
Yeah.
Chi-Chi: It's awesome to be here. I'm so excited to see you two. And you guys have been great to work with.
Megan: Thank you.
Friend: Three tall ladies, the average height on this call
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Friend: is almost six feet.
Megan: But anyways, we just, should we do this? Should we do this. podcast? I can't wait. I'm actually having a hard time controlling my excitement, which is audible to the, to the listeners.
Friend: Please excuse the fidgeting.
Megan: Please excuse my ex my like feelings. Chi-Chi, what is your average day, or is there an average day as a photographer?
Chi-Chi: Well, I would say there are two types of days, so they're our shoot days and they're non shoot days. So shoot days are probably the most exciting. I usually prepare all my equipment the day before. So I'm out, I'm shooting, I'm, you know, interacting with the client. If it's a wedding, it's, it's a full day. So just kind of like, on set all day. Other shoots, some are longer than others, but really like the day is focused on the shoot. I come home, I put my memory card in the computer and just like download the photos immediately because I can never lose one. So. Those are shoot days. Non shoot days a little bit more flexible. A lot of admin work, a lot of post-work. So that's editing photos from the previous shoot or, preparing for an upcoming shoot, researching, coordinating with the, clients and just all that preparation. And then of course, working on my marketing and sales and all the things to run a business.
Friend: What is the split, would you say between shoot days and admin days?
Chi-Chi: Mostly admin days. shoot days, you know, are mostly if it's a wedding usually on the weekend. and then I do have like some smaller shoots, like spread out through the week, maybe like on a Thursday or Friday. So most of the big chunk of it is just the post work and admin work and putting everything together.
Friend: behind the scenes.
Chi-Chi: A lot of behind the scenes and also learning, that's like a big part of what I do is just like, you know, expanding my skills. So even on, um, on a not official shoot day, I might just create a shoe for myself just to like, keep practicing, keep learning, or, you know, take a class like in an online class or read, or even like listen to blogs and podcasts and stuff like that.
Just like trying to keep expanding my skills.
Friend: Yeah, that's cool. What is it about this career that was attractive to you?
Chi-Chi: Honestly, I I've always been a curious creative, so, I just have like so many interests when it comes to creative work and. I think it all falls together because I love memory. I love capturing memory and I've been keeping a journal since I was like 10. so I really fell into it. I just, I always had a camera in hand, especially when I moved to New York, because there's so much to see in New York, you know, it's New York. And so I just always had a camera in hand, always taking photos. And from there, I just like kept building up with it.
Friend: You weren't always, in this, right. Was this something you knew from a child would be a good fit or did you start and start somewhere else and meander around, back into it?
Chi-Chi: I didn't even know. I didn't think of a creative job as like an option. So as a child, it was like, oh yeah, it's cool. I mean, I'm interested in all these creative things, but I have to. The, in the real world. so was pre-med in college for the first three years and I was like, I guess I'm going to be a doctor, maybe a pediatrician.
I like kids, I guess.
I know. And then my last year I'm like, you know what? I really don't like this. And I'm in college. I took a lot of. Like I took some costume design classes and like, those are my hobbies and I was always in fashion design clubs and stuff like that. And so I'm like, you know what, maybe I'm going to try fashion.
So after college on a whim, I applied to fashion school and that's what got me to New York. And so I studied fashion actually. And I worked in the industry for many years. So that was like my full-time job as a fashion designer. and like I said earlier, I just have a lot of curiosities. I went from, you know, like fashion design and kind of transition, very seamlessly into photography.
Friend: Yeah, well, you're amazing. And so then word of mouth just goes like wildfire, I think.
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Megan: My husband's like what's Chi-Chi doing, like, I don't know. I'll call her soon.
Friend: When can we see her again?
Megan: Seriously. I have a question that might be random, but I just wanted to interject with this because I think a lot of people can maybe relate. Were your parents horrified when you chose what you chose? How did you deal with that?
Chi-Chi: Yeah, definitely. And I mean, now I understand, like, it's like, you know, you just want something stable for your kids. I'm Nigerian, my parents are Nigerian and. I don't think they really understood the industry. So honestly, when I was like, you know what, I think I'm going to go to move to in New York and go to fashion school. It's like, okay, why, what does this mean? What are you, what are you going to do with that? Like, you know, you could be a nurse if you don't really want to be a doctor, you know, like that's kinda where it was. but then it wasn't till like I started. You know, I got like a job. I started working at Ralph Lauren and it was like, oh, okay. We, we know that name. it makes sense. I mean, I guess there are people who, who work there and design they're like, you know, so, um, yeah, so they just, they they've been on board since.
Yeah.
Friend: That's cool. Do you think that the work in fashion helped with your eye as a photographer?
Chi-Chi: You know what,, I think so, maybe I'm not sure to be honest. I did study, I mean, studying fashion in school was really, really amazing for me just because I was pre-med in college, so all my classes were like science classes, math classes. And I never, even though I took, my costume design class which I loved. Being in school, studying fashion and like even having the stress of schoolwork and homework and like deadlines and stuff, but it was like good stress. You know, it, wasn't the same kind of stress where it's like, oh my gosh, I'm studying this organic chemistry. And I need to, ace this tests. I was like, oh my gosh, I have a deadline to make this collection, but it's really exciting. So I think just kind of like study creative work informed my photography. So just kind of in fashion, you know, we research on a collection, we researched color, we research, you know, patterns and texture and all that stuff. And with photography, I do a lot of research, you know, I research what the location's going to be.
Like. I research, you know, the clients their personalities, their mood, try to talk to them a lot to kind of see how you're feeling about the shoot, so it's a lot of research and then putting it all together. It relates in a way.
Megan: Yeah, it's a similar skillset, you
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Friend: Yeah.
I just was wondering if you know, if that would inform your photographic style, because I'm new to this. I know I love your images, but I don't know if I have the words to describe it or, or could categorize it. So just wondered if there was something there or if you would explain it in a different way.
Chi-Chi: definitely. I would say I do like having an eye for fashion, so I tend to move towards like the editorial side. when I'm photographing, especially with the weddings, I try to bring a little bit of like a fashion editorial spread to the gallery.
Friend: Got it. Okay.
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Friend: Alright right, let's transition a little bit. I could talk about your fabulous career and skills all day. Oh my goodness. But I am here to talk about your money a little bit, let's ease into it, if we may. The first question is on a scale of one to 10, where would you place yourself in terms of comfort? Talking about finances.
Chi-Chi: I would say, so there are two parts. Like the first part would be like what's pricing asking for money. And I would say with that, I'm a good, like eight, nine I'm getting up there. when it comes to like handling my finances and all of that kind of stuff and bookkeeping, and that that's like a whole different level, I'm probably maybe like a four.
Friend: Your tone of voice just changed, just dropped. We went dark.
Megan: it's so funny.
Friend: Love it. Okay, cool, and the grid?
Chi-Chi: Yeah, I would say definitely all the way creative and then probably in the, a little bit closer to the splurge or I don't know, I would say either in the middle like maybe one notch on the splurge.
Friend: Okay. What's a splurge for you?
Chi-Chi: I spend on business things, so like,
Friend: You ladies are so practical.
All everybody to talk to. Everyone I talked to has been like I splurge for my business.
Chi-Chi: splurges are business, and also
Friend: That's not a splurge. It's an investment.
Chi-Chi: I guess you're right. I guess, I guess I would say food. I love food a lot and I will spend money on food.
Megan: Wait, but maybe, maybe we've hit something here because maybe we're using the word splurge when we should using the word investment.
Chi-Chi: Hmm.
Friend: Or ask both.
Megan: Like I'm investing in my business.
Friend: maybe we should have just defined it before. Like for me a splurge is like, I'm just throwing my money off out of open window and just for fun,
Chi-Chi: Okay.
Friend: You know,
Chi-Chi: Yeah, it makes sense. It makes sense. So I would say, both, like I splurge on certain things and I save on certain things. So like business aside, like I will splurge on food. I'll just kind of like spend that extra money. I'll add the guac.
Megan: The best example.
Chi-Chi: I know. All right, I'll get the appetizer and the drink, like I just, I will splurge on.
Friend: That's awesome. I love it. Cool. we talked a little bit about the admin work. How much of the finances of your business do you manage and how much do you outsource?
Chi-Chi: let's just say I outsource most of it because I do not like doing all that stuff. And I learned, I think I learned the hard way because you know, starting off the businesses kind of want to wear all the hats. So you're like, okay, I guess I have to do everything. I'm the creative, I'm the marketer, I'm the sales person. I'm the bookkeeper. And you know, when you're small, you can kind of get away with that. So I did all of that. I like handle my taxes and then as you grow, you're like, okay, wait a second. You definitely need more help. You know? And outsourcing, definitely saves you time and money. So I am a hundred percent like on and when it comes to outsourcing the finances.
Friend: And then do you come back to those vendors or service providers and, say like, so I'm the CEO. do you have questions for me? Do you have challenges for it? Like, do you kind of get them to help you with the management information that comes out of that work? Or is it like hands-off, I don't want to know. File the taxes.
Chi-Chi: It's kind of hands off. I don't want to know. It's just kind of, you know, like these are my goals. Here are my books, like file the taxes. me know, you know, like what I need to do, what I need to think about what I need to focus on and then we'll take it from there.
Friend: All right. Cool. What about you mentioned pricing a little bit earlier when
we were talking about the comfort scale. so it sounds like you're fairly comfortable there. What is your approach to setting prices?
Chi-Chi: Really, I just start with the expenses. So on shoots. I usually have an assistant, maybe a second photographer. So just kind of like setting that budget, like what is the pricing going to be? I cover expenses first. And then I think about the time it's going to take me.
So from pre production, shoot day a post-production also the outsourcing, like I have a couple of editors that I work with all of that. So I kind of put that all together, along with the timing. And I kind of like have an hourly rate that I give myself and that's how I come up with my pricing.
Friend: That seems very logical.
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Megan: It's important to remember to factor in all those extras, right? Because your hours answering emails and your hours on the train and your hours of organizing your, gear or whatever, you know, like it's all
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Megan: It has to be all accounted for. I used to forget that and now I'm getting better at it.
Chi-Chi: it's a lot of time. It's not just the eight hour shoot day, you know, it's also pre shoot or like post you even. I do all sorts of a lot of my editing, but like I still go through every single image and I give a lot of notes and like all of that. So it takes a long time.
Friend: Yeah, that's good. You're factoring in so much then I think you're also. Probably more likely to be reasonable, but when you can and can't take on another client, like if you've priced yourself appropriately, you don't need to take all the work. So you can take the work that you need, and then you're busy working on that work and you're being paid for the time behind the scenes.
Chi-Chi: Exactly. Definitely.
Friend: Has your pricing strategy evolved at all as you? How many years have you been doing this now?
Chi-Chi: Oh, this is my seventh year this is my fourth year doing it full time for seven years shooting altogether. And yeah, I would say it's definitely changed since the beginning of. You know, a lot of free work. And I feel like it's a little taboo to say, you know, like I'm a creative and I did free work, but honestly, like I was happy to do it because I just wanted to get out there.
I just wanted to shoot. And so, you know, like I was open to, you know, having people give me their budgets and like, I'll take it on. so yeah, that's how it was in the beginning. And then as, my skills improved or demanding improved, to price myself appropriately. it's definitely changed a lot.
Friend: Yeah, that's good. What would you say is the next evolution of that? If any, like where do you go from here? So now you're full-time and you've got the work you want and you've got the support you want. it sounds like your pricing is you're comfortable with it. What comes next?
Chi-Chi: I mean, I guess the next thing is to me is, keeping more profit with less time. So it was the whole time money thing. So it's, you know, how can I expand my skills? How can I be more efficient? How can I even have a better customer experience, you know? So just kind of like putting all those things together where I can, increase the pricing and also decrease my time.
So also a lot more outsourcing and all of that. So I think that's the next step when it comes to the business and how it's going to go.
Megan: Your daughter is saying, hi,
Chi-Chi: Oh, no, you hear her.
Friend: It's all good we love all of our working mothers How old is she now?
Chi-Chi: 14 months
Friend: my gosh.
Megan: My goodness.
Friend: All right. it sounds like that's a matter of scaling.
Chi-Chi: So honestly it's the whole, the time of money thing. how much time am I spending? really being able to cut that down and how much profit of my keeping. you know, I remember when I first started, like I was shooting a long full day weddings, like basically like almost I have to send out like the whole day I was spending hours and hours and hours editing You know, my rates weren't even what they are now. So I was charging a whole lot less. as I'm growing, I'm loving to see the progression of like, my packages are priced appropriately. I know the amount of time I'm spending. as time goes on, I'm more intentional about how I'm pricing and the time I spend, I really, really make sure that I take count of how much time I'm spending for each project.
Friend: That's awesome.
Megan: Isn't it nice when you hit that, like sort of just a moment of understanding how much your time is actually worth? our friend here would be mad at me cause I don't have like a great breakdown of it. But for our next meeting, in person in New York, I'm going to bring you like a spreadsheet to show you because Chi-Chi, I recently went out of town I realized how valuable I am in a lot of ways that I wasn't really like putting money towards. Right. And then. Just putting that on paper to plan. I was like, whoa, my time is extremely valuable. You know, just time alone let alone the skill it's wild.
Chi-Chi: Definitely.
Friend: We're going to do a full episode on pricing strategy and how to consider everything and not just like, well, I guess guess this makes sense per hour. No. think about the whole scope of it. And don't, you know, don't underestimate all the things that go into it.
Chi-Chi: Yeah, another big thing in pricing. And you know, I'm thinking a lot of like my wedding photography, but there's other stuff I do, like portraits of stuff. It's just how it's going to be used. how you price a portrait for, someone's website will be different from how you price it for someone's book or an album cover or anything like that. So usage is definitely a big part
Friend: That's a good angle.
Megan: Yeah, I never thought of that.
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Friend: Well, hopefully that was fine. We didn't, I didn't ask you how much you made last year. Right?
Everything was fine.
Chi-Chi: Yes.
Friend: I'll hand over to you, Megan. You're in good hands.
Megan: Okay. Chi-Chi let's chat a little bit about art, even though it's like woven into this whole story, but we'll switch. So are you ready?
Chi-Chi: Yes.
Megan: Okay. I first wanna start with one of the questions I love do you love your job?
Chi-Chi: I do I do. I love, I love a lot of aspects. I love the creative part of it. I don't like the admin part of it. I still do like some of the post-production, so I like editing. Um, usually, you know, You images and I'll send this out to my editor was like a lot of notes and then they get it back and I review everything. so I kind of, I liked that part, but I don't like the behind the scenes admin stuff,
Megan: I know it's tiring.
Chi-Chi: yeah, but I have to say sometimes, I'm at a wedding and I see all the joy and the love and the hugs and I'm like, oh my gosh, this is why I do this. This is awesome. I love it.
Megan: All that makes me happy.
Chi-Chi: Yeah,
Megan: Do you have a favorite artist?
Chi-Chi: I can't pick just one or two. I can't say I do. I really love so many genres of art. I love film. I love movies. I love music. When it comes to like music, I really liked John Mayer just cause I think he's an incredible writer. like artists that make you feel and with music and film, I, feel a lot. So, John Mayer, I think is great with film. I love Wes Anderson. I think he's just incredible. And he also informs a lot of my photography. You know, it's just a lot of inspiration, his symmetry, the use of color, the use of light, like she's amazing.
Megan: That's so interesting. The film thing I never would have thought of, but that's so aligns with your style of photography. okay. Do you go to or visit museums or do you collect any original art?
Chi-Chi: Yeah, it's something I want to be into. I don't do it enough. Like I see all these shows like coming up, I'm like, oh, I'm definitely gonna go. But then life happens and I'm like, dang it. I didn't go.
Megan: I mean, you have the perfect tiny excuse currently. So don't stress also toddlers aren't notoriously like the greatest at viewing art.
Chi-Chi: Yes. I learned that the hard way. I'm like, oh, I'm going to just take her to the museum. I'm going to do it. And that was like, okay, now I know not to do this anymore.
Megan: Yeah. It's like, let's maybe just not do that for awhile.
Where do you find inspiration for your work?
Chi-Chi: have to say, movies like film. So when I watch movies, I don't just watch for the story. I watch it for the lighting. I watched it for the cinematography. I even watch it for like what I call blocking, how the characters are posed around each other, even though it's, you know, it's a moving image, just kind of like, okay, it's a couple and they're in love.
And like how they're standing, they're not posed specifically, but just the blocking. And I like, I love watching movies and just kind of even group shots, like, oh, how are you? How's the family together. Like how are they positioned? And that really informs how I shoot. Like when I go out to, you know, maybe shoot a wedding or to shoot anything, even maybe portraits, I'm just like, okay.
I like keep in mind all the movies and film I've watched. And I get a lot of inspiration from that.
Friend: I think we just cracked, what makes Chichi the best at what she does?
Megan: So seriously, I'm like picturing photos she's taken of me and I'm like, I've never felt awkward in any photo
Friend: Yeah,
Megan: like a perfect understanding.
I even just like good angles. It's not about that. It's like capturing a good moment.
Chi-Chi: Yeah. Like, I like it to be realistic. Like I want it to look like real life, you know, I'm really, I'm really big on that. And that's why I love watching movies. And I'm like, you know, these are actors portraying real life. Like, how are they standing? how do they look? You know, it's very different for them. This is a photo and we have to stand like this and we have to smile like this, you know?
Megan: And for the people who are awkward in this room, meaning I'm the host of this podcast. It is hard to look like a normal person in a photo. If you're either shy or weird or a enormous person.
Friend: have been used to know, you know, what happened at work? The other day, I went into the office for the first time. In two years we had a pizza party and it was like, excrutiatingly awkward because they wanted to take our picture and no one wanted to stand beside me because I was so tall, like in grade seven. And so when you come into it with that, you need to Chichi
Megan: Yeah, you do. You need someone to be like everyone stopped acting weird.
Friend: So Chichi, if you are watching any movies and there are awkwardly tall characters and you have any tips for us
Megan: tough.
Friend: where to stand. That's cool though, that you're, you're studying, you're watching and you're studying the placement of people. I've never thought of that.
Chi-Chi: Yeah. Yeah. It's fun. I love it. Yeah.
Megan: That's wild. Okay. If you could have a dinner party with four other creative people, dead or alive, who would you invite?
Chi-Chi: Oh, well, my four people would be, so Maria Abramovic, uh, she is a performance artist. I really like her. Like I said, I love, you know, I love the art makes you feel, and these are people that just like really make me feel. And she's just so deep in her thinking and her performance. So she's number one. Number two would be Daniel Kaluuya is an actor. He did Get Out. He's incredible. He's literally my number one right now. He's just so amazing. Like he really brings you into the character and just makes you feel what they're feeling, what they're imagining. So, I would definitely have him there.
I would have Patricia Fields, so, you know, from my fashion world, she's the costume designer behind Sex in the City. And I just think she's brilliant. Like you're looking at those cosutmes. Like how, like how did you even think about that? So, that would be my fashion person. And then, Greg Williams, he's a photographer. shoots a lot of celebrities, a lot of like Oscar parties and stuff like that. But his candid photos are incredible. you feel the emotion, you feel that energy and every single photo. And I think he's amazing.
Megan: You forgot to mention one very important dinner guest. You saw him recently while shooting a wedding.
Chi-Chi: Oh, George Clooney.
Megan: She saw George Clooney.
Chi-Chi: Yes It was, amazing. So I'm shooting. I was doing family portraits and you know, a bunch of people started like gathering on the side and they were like, say stuff and like, and then the family was like, oh my gosh. And I couldn't hear who it was. And I'm like, you know what, let me just go. Let me like, shoot. So I went and I started snapping. I was like, George Clooney.
Megan: Did you get to talk to him?
Chi-Chi: No, he moved, really fast. I think he actually talked to grandmother of the family. I was shooting. I think he said a word or two to her, but he moved pretty fast, but yeah, I got a photo and I was like, oh my gosh.
Megan: The grandma's like fanning herself in the corner, like, oh, just like overcome.
Friend: So once I saw Hugh Grant, I could never appreciate him again because I saw him in person. He was old and fat. Was George Clooney like that? Or is he really that beautiful?
Chi-Chi: He really is that dreamy. He's just like he is on TV. I think the rest of the day I was like, my energy was up there. I was like, oh my gosh, we saw George Clooney.
Megan: He seems kind of magical, like not to be dorky about it, but like he has like a twinkle in his eyes. He's like a effervescent
Chi-Chi: Yeah, he was really nice. I mean, I just saw him kind of like walk in with his wife and of course, like his people by his side, but he was just very, very charming, you know, I think he likes, smiled at people. He weighed a little bit and just walks right on by, but it was awesome.
I think it was my favorite, like celebrity sighting so far.
Friend: Um, did you just say that you saw George Clooney and his wife? Is she as beautiful
Chi-Chi: She is, they are really good looking just like you see them on TV. I was, I was impressed.
Friend: What do you think they were doing?
Chi-Chi: I have no clue. I was wondering, I mean, it was just them and. A few of their people and they just walked right in and yeah, they were there for some time. Maybe some kind of meeting, I guess.
Friend: At the library, like the one on fifth and 42nd?
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Megan: Like we're Carrie and Big, got married.
Chi-Chi: Yeah. And it was open. I mean, the library stayed open, so people were coming in and out, so I'm sure they, you know, have some kind of meeting in a private room.
Friend: Maybe she needed to do some research.
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Megan: Anyway started to poach your dinner party. But I was like, I have to weave that into conversation. I'll just bring George we'll come to the party also. Ah, sigh. Okay. We're going to do a little rapid fire right now, but some people are more rapid than others. We'll see how this goes. Are you ready?
Okay. Dogs or cats?
Chi-Chi: Dogs.
Megan: Do you have a dog?
Chi-Chi: I don't have pets, but I like the little ones you can hold in your hand. Only the ?Small ones. I'm a little scared of the bigger ones, unless they were like really, really friendly
Megan: Yeah, I get that. It's kind of intense. Okay. A City Hall elopement, or a destination wedding?
Chi-Chi: Destination wedding.
Yeah.
Friend: For you or to shoot?
Chi-Chi: Oh, to shoot for me, City Hall.
Megan: That's funny.
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Megan: What's the best destination wedding you've ever been to
Chi-Chi: I just did one in Costa Rica early this year. It was beautiful. Great weather, great space. I loved it.
Megan: That's cool. It sounds amazing. I'll go also. okay. Tik Tok or, Instagram?
Chi-Chi: Instagram. I'm not that hip with social media. And as the new ones come, I'm just like, oh gosh, I'm starting to feel old.
Megan: We haven't had a single person say to talk yet. Like it's not, we're not of the right, age demographic for that. Tea or coffee?
Really.
Friend: What kind of tea?
Chi-Chi: So I don't drink coffee at all. My husband loves tea. So he has a lot of different types. He like always gets different blends every time he travel, he goes for the teas. And so he has a lot, I'm not really like a big tea person, but since he has so many, like, he'll just make me a blend every now and then.
Friend: Oh, nice.
Megan: lovely. Okay. Film or digital?
Chi-Chi: Digital.
Megan: Do you ever shoot film?
Chi-Chi: I don't shoot film, but I, do want to start. I just love the look of it. It's beautiful. So I wanna just start dabbling in it a little bit.
Megan: It feels riskier to me though.
Chi-Chi: Yeah. But it also feels more intentional. Like you have to really make sure, like, you're getting the shot. You can't just snap, snap, snap, you know?
Megan: I don't think you would have trouble with that part of it. I don't. I truly don't, but I, I get why digital is used more often. It just seems like more forgiving maybe.
Chi-Chi: Yeah,
Megan: Paper or eBooks?
Chi-Chi: EBooks all the way,
Megan: gasp.
Chi-Chi: All the way. I know everyone likes like paper books, but I love eBooks. Like you could take it anywhere. You could have a hundred books and you could take it anywhere.
You could read three books at a time.
Friend: What do you read on?
Chi-Chi: The Kindle.
Megan: I've always wanted to convert, but I'm like, I need to touch the book. It's a weird thing.
Chi-Chi: I know. Yeah. I mean, if it's a book I really, really love for me to like, get the hard cover, but I'm fine with the the ebook.
Megan: She's like, let me make my choices. Okay. What was your worst subject in school growing up?
Chi-Chi: um,
Megan: She didn't have one.
Friend: one.
Megan: I
Chi-Chi: Well,
Megan: was a straight, a
Friend: was
Chi-Chi: no, no, no, no. I guess I'll say chemistry.
Megan: Fair,
Chi-Chi: Yeah.
Who likes chemistry?
Friend: How much of that did you have to take in pre-med?
Chi-Chi: My first year I took general chemistry and then labs. Oh, I hated the labs. I hated those. So I took two years. Two years of chemistry, regular chemistry, then organic chemistry, and then the labs for both years.
Megan: Wow. I'm speechless, which is unusual.
Chi-Chi: Yeah. just I'm glad those days are over.
Friend: Me too.
Megan: Yeah, it's tough to do something. You're not sure about. What was your favorite book as a little kid?
Chi-Chi: Favorite book? I liked Shel Silverstein.
Megan: Oh, we
Chi-Chi: Yeah. And that's another set of books Sweet Valley High was really nice.
Megan: I love series, you know? Cause you wanted to know the story. It kind of goes with your, your whole thing of needing a long story to follow. It makes sense. Okay, favorite place to travel?
Chi-Chi: Internationally or,
Megan: Internationally.
Chi-Chi: Okay. I guess to be honest, I love my husband makes fun of me cause I just, I love Mexico and anytime he's like, let's go on a trip. I'm like, let's go to Mexico. And he's like, there are other places in the world.
Megan: But it's so easy.
Chi-Chi: Yeah, It's beautiful. So those are, that's my favorite place that I've been, definitely have a whole list of places I want to go to.
Megan: I know such wanderlust. okay. The last question we already answered, so I can't ask you, but I'll add one more. Favorite person on this podcast?
Friend: And what is her name?
Megan: She's anonymous.
Friend: Please state her name.
Megan: Oh my gosh. All I want to do is have you come visit so we can do another photo day.
Friend: I've been trying to think of ways where Megan and I can get some photos for the podcast without showing my face.
Megan: I know. That's the tricky part.
Friend: If you have any ideas,
Megan: That'd be a fun project.
Chi-Chi: You might have to like, hold something front, like maybe like a book or something.
Megan: We could do like us laughing in a cafe, but like something in her, in your face.
Chi-Chi: Yeah,
Megan: Anyways. Well, we love you and we're so thankful for you taking the time to be with us.
Chi-Chi: Thank you for having me.
Megan: It's hard to carve out, so we really appreciate your time.
Chi-Chi: Thanks for having me. This was so fun. So nice chatting with you two.
Megan: that's super important though, is where can people find you on the internet?
Chi-Chi: Oh yes. So my Instagram is Chichi, Ari Love. That's the one I update the most and online is chichiarilove.com
Megan: So good. I like just was on your website, just doing a quick stock the other day. Like, oh my God. It's still so good.
Chi-Chi: Thank you.
Megan: Then we have one last question for you. The former teacher in me really likes to ask, do you have a question or a suggestion or a homework assignment for our list? So we'd like to challenge them to work on something sort of related to the guest or related to that week's topic. What would you recommend that people work on?
Chi-Chi: Yeah. So homework wise is to almost the art in things you wouldn't first think about as art. So like watching a movie like that is art. So look for all the artistic expression in the movie, look at the costumes, look at the blocking, the placement of people. Look at the lighting and its belief. Focus on all the expressions of art in that movie.
Megan: I love that.
Friend: Any particular movie or can I just choose my own?
Chi-Chi: Gosh, there's so many. One that's coming to my mind right now is Queen and Slim. That's probably one of my favorite movies. It's amazing. You should definitely check it out.
There's also a movie called The Lobster. it's a Collin Farrel. really, really love it. It's kind of like hit or miss some people hate it, some people love it and I love it.
Megan: It's like super quirky. Right?
Chi-Chi: Yes. It's very quirky. And I love movies that are a little bit like off the beaten path and just kind of different, movies that make you think movies that make you feel so. Yeah,
Megan: That's great. We can do this homework. We can handle this.
Friend: I want to watch them both. That sound awesome.
Megan: again. We love you. And this was super fun.
Chi-Chi: Yes, this is awesome. Thank you for having me.
Friend: Thank you for being here. That was awesome.
Woo. That was good. I'm so glad we finally got Chi-Chi on the schedule. We had to work for that one a little bit, but it was worth the wait.
Megan: She's the best truly magical. A magical person, also her photos, I wish, I mean, we'll share them in the show notes, some of the examples of her work, but she captured me, which we mentioned awkward and my family in such a natural, calm, happy way, which is heroic. You know, it's like not easy.
Friend: Yeah. You guys look like angels.
Megan: Angels sent from
Friend: Yeah, exactly. Models, model angels.
Megan: Well, that.
Friend: Yeah, I thought that was really cool, how we ended up going into pricing strategy with her. I don't know if that was particularly in the show notes or the plan, but it was perfect timing. We already had planned for the next episode to be around pricing. And that was based on some questions that we got from a listener. And so I think it's, perfect, we're gonna draw a little bit more from what she has shared with us and I'm really looking forward to that. I think it's, we're just going into pricing season, so get ready.
Megan: I like how she mentioned her time being so valuable. I think that's like a huge turning point for women in business. Once, you know, your time is valuable. That's when you know how to price yourself better.
Friend: Yeah. And then I think it gives you freedom to say no and be okay with saying no and not just take every job and run yourself ragged.
Megan: Right.
Friend: Yeah. Awesome.
Megan: She's the best. Thank you again, Chichi.
Friend: Yeah. All right. And next week, stay tuned for Pricing 1 0 1 or whatever we decide to call it.
Megan: It's going to be a doozy.
Friend: As always, for listening to The Arts.
Megan: This is Megan of Art by Megan.
Friend: And her friend, your patron of the arts.
Megan: Wishing you more art.
Friend: And maybe, a better understanding of your money. Bye.